So, Microsoft, if you're wondering why people hate you, it's because of decisions like this. It's because it's blatantly obvious that your priorities are to squeeze every last dime you can from your locked-in customers as opposed to giving them a good user experience. If Yousif can create a no-hassle standalone installer for IE 7, so can Microsoft, if it wanted to act in good will. But apparently, it doesn't.
And here's some more. I tried to download IE 7 using FireFox on OS X (I was going to copy it to my shared folder for use in Parallels.) Can I do this? No. Why not? Because Microsoft requires you to validate your copy of Windows before you download the release candidate for IE 7. WTF? I'm on OS X. OK, so I switch over to my Windows install on Parallels and fire up IE and it asks me to install a plugin so Microshaft Microsoft can probe my computer to see if I'm a terrorist software pirate. Papers please!
Now that's bad in and of itself but what's worse is that stupid IE is now stuck trying to install the plugin. I swear, I'd be laughing my ass off if I was watching this in a comedy. If you don't want to put up with this "genuine advantage" bullshit, download Yousif's standalone installer and you should be up and running in no time.
Microsoft is so clueless, I wonder if they see how much market share they are going to be losing in the coming years. The thing about the amount of bad will they've accumulated through the years is that it doesn't have an immediate effect. It takes time for things to change but you can be sure that enough people are pissed off that things are changing. You only have to attend a developer-heavy conference this year to see the disproportionate number of new Intel Macs to PCs. Steve Ballmer may rave like a lunatic about developers all he likes but let me tell you Stevey boy (*ducks flying chair*), your developers are switching in droves to Macs and Linux.
(By the way, I ended up installing IE 7 using Yousif's installer and it took only a minute or two and I was up and running without any hassles. Thank you, Yousif, and shame on you, Microsoft!)
The Why do people hate Microsoft? article by Aral Balkan, unless otherwise expressly stated, is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-Noncommercial 2.0 UK: England License.
Aral,
But Microsoft does give you Virtual PC for FREE!
http://www.microsoft.com/windows/virtualpc/default.mspx
Get on the virtualization bandwagon.
And if you really, really hate Microsoft, then go with VMWare:
http://www.vmware.com/products/free_virtualization.html
I now use a virtual pc for all betas, evals, etc.
After you create your first virtual image, make a backup. Then whenever you need another new image you can just dupe it.
Best regards,
g
Another example is the stupid application called MAX from MS. I installed the .net framework 3.0 beta, and then MAX… just to realise they only support NTFS. The least they could do is mention this in the system requirements…
They might have new software up their sleeves but they cannot get it to install on the end user’s system in a way they would like to…
shut up! stop with shit talkin..
im using ie7 here for 4 months and its running sweetly.
im sorry for your bad experiences in-a-row, but you’re the only one to blame.
strive youself harder man
Aral
MS’s target market is the general public, those who are not suppose to required to be computer savvy to use a PC. Sure, it would be nice to have the option to install it as another instance but thats just one more option to confuse the less-savvy.
Additionally, MS forces users to upgrade rather than using old techology. Ya, we as developers could care less about this, but then againdo we really want our clients to continue using old browser technology?
Lastly, IE is tied into many features of the OS. I am certain MS does not want to deal with the issues that running two differing versions may represent.
Finally, why not direct these comments to MS? I hear a lot of complaining about MS but they do listen to developers. But you have to talk to them. Ask the tens of thousands of MS developers, MS does listen
I guess as long as there are people there will be MS haters. All I can say of MS is “thank you”. Without MS the internet would not be as far as it is today and many of us may not have jobs. They are not perfect, but neither is FF, Opera, Safari or any other browser, OS, office suite, server etc. Name a product and I’ll tell you something I hate about it.
Hi Nah,
Did you read my post before commenting? I didn’t comment once about how IE 7 runs. In fact, apart from some brief testing for my latest blog post I haven’t had the occasion to run IE 7. So, it’s quite possible, as you state, that it runs really well (with the 7th version, you’d think they’d get something right.)
My post is about the horrible download process that you have to go through in order to get IE 7 in the first place.
I’d love to hear how it is somehow my fault that I have to go through such a painful experience and jump through so many hoops just to download an application.
Hi TJ,
It is exactly these less-computer savvy individuals who would be most confused by such a convoluted installation process. Why do I have to install a plugin to verify the validity of the license of my operating system before being allowed to download a web browser by the same company?
The problem is that the download process is so unnecessarily complicated. Especially when compared to how easy it is to download and install IE 7 using Yousif’s installer.
Personally, I fail to see what value Microsoft adds to the Internet. Is there some Internet innovation that I’m missing that Microsoft is responsible for?
Hi Greg,
I’m already on the virtualization bandwagon with Parallels!
However, I find creating a new virtual machine for each version of Internet Explorer I want to test with to be overkill. Also, you would need a license of Windows XP for each virtual machine. Granted, I have ten licenses for the darn thing so I could if I wanted to but it would be ridiculous.
In any case, it’s unnecessary, since there are ways to run different versions of IE together and Yousif’s actually created a simple installer that lets you install multiple instances of IE on the same machine.
Aral
the internet did not really kick into gear for the general public until MS came out with the massive ad campaign “Where do you want to go today?”. As many internet companies can tell you from that period, this ad campaign launched us into a frenzied development process due to the overwhelming tresponse from the public. ISPs will also tell you that ad campaign launched their services into a mainstream service. No, MS isnt directly responsible for any particular innnovation, they are responsible for getting the public onboard. No single company has given the internet the exposure to the masses that MS has, and we as developers seem to forget that.
Also, as said before, you should mention your concerns to MS. The product is still a beta and as such they are open to making changes. Office 20007 was delayed because testers complained about how sluggish the product was.
Actually, the final release of IE7 will appear on Windows Update (and Automatic Updates), so it will be pretty seamless for most not-so-savvy users. Be thankful you didn’t get it downloaded because there’s another Genuine Advantage check in the installer
I understand both sides, I grew up loving DOS command prompt, then ‘98, 2000, and finally winXP. I then had to learn Apple OS 9 for music/audio production, and hated it for anything else, but was gradually fully weaned from winXP with the release of OSX. And it’s only been mana from heaven since then.
But seriously, when will we see Flex Builder 2 for OS X?
I forgot to mention, I think windows users will be very happy and leap into the future with the release of Vista, and perhaps Microsoft is letting winXP user experience rust and decay so that their users will all eagerly shift to Vista.
Here are a few places we can leave feedback on IE7 :-
http://blogs.msdn.com/ie/default.aspx
http://msdn.microsoft.com/ie/
http://forums.microsoft.com/msdn/showforum.aspx?forumid=923&siteid=1
We would all benefit from the Flash community raising it’s profile a bit on the Microsoft forums !!
Graeme, you might be right saying we would all benefit helping MS, but… I would preffer if we all benefit helping other companies, not helping the monopoly MS has.
I don’t even bother on downloading IE7. What for?
Thanks God there are many options that are free and you can download-install without any hassle, then “tune it” as you wish with many cool and usefull extensions.
anyway, where do you want to go tomorrow? that’s important
the ones thinking about “where to go today” are just copying what the pioneers have already done (png support, better CSS support, tabs…)
salut
hi,
This is to all those people who love MS.CAn u people tell one good reason why we should not hate (HATE) MS? MS is a nonsense.And for each reason you tell, there will be one answer to it.
I completely agree with “Ernesto Quezada “, why help MS? I would prefer helping companies who help me.
Talking about “ease of use”,”for general people”, Have you tried recent versions of Linux YET !!?If not try out and you will never say that again. MS was the first to shout aloud about single click install of OS.I still never saw an Windows installer, which is singl;e click.Try out UBUNTU. Two clicks and thats it.
Have you tried LIVES CDS of Linuxes yet? hopefully not. Try out the softwares before actually using it through live CDs.
Then for what I should not hate MS.For Bugs, for turture and for unreliability the list will never end.
If MS is not going to pay attention to people, which is their business not mine to take care of their products.I have a product and I am not happy, so I am not going to talk to company that please fix these bugs so that I will use your product.Thats solely their responsible and if they can not keep up with it then they will only lose.
We have a lots and lots of good products arround. Talking about IE, do you know what they had done with Netscape?If no then know it.Whether MS is really for you.If you kill one good fellow there will be thousands, what will you do? Now, come and compete with FIREFOX or OPERA ? I can not see a competition of IE with other browsers.The competition of browsers are now with Firefox and Opera.
Beleive it or not, you will come to join us, if not today, it will be tomorrow.Buts its for sure if MS will not change their philosophy it will be no where.
I do not care about what will happen to MS, rather can not consider it anymore int he competition.There a rea lot of good players now competiting. All the best to all of them.
“Without MS the internet would not be as far as it is today”
well we’d sure be A LOT further along if ms would pull their head out of their dumb ass and get with the program. Maybe ms did help start things moving along but right now they are holding everything up, hell they cant even make their own code run right in their own products (ever see copy & pasted text from word break a web page?)
The funny thing is all these ms brown nosers love the “new” features of ms yet the rest of us have been enjoying them for years and since ms actually cant come up with anything by itself it will always be that way. Except that the stuff ms “borrows” actually runs right on the originators systems, ms cant even copy something right.
What I REALLY love is how ms cant make a decent program so they buy out one of the good programs in that area and then destroy it lol, ex: when ms bought sunbelts anti-spyware to “cover-up” their piss ass poor os’s holes, sunbelt was rated pretty consistently at the top, i just read consumer reports article for this year and now its at the bottom in the 50% dissatisfaction range (pretty much like every ms product), at least they are consistant.
As a developer the only thing ms does for me is make my life miserable, constantly having to do hack jobs to get things to run on that crap system of theirs.
It’s amazing, they have all the $$ in the world but can’t make products as good as some guy in his basement who does it for free.
Pretty f*ckin sad……
thank god for os x!
The thing to bear in mind is Microsoft isn’t a one evil man entity.
There are developers working for MS who I’m sure, most of which, are dedicated to their jobs and not trying to screw every penny out of users.
Admitidly the corporate giant as a whole might have issues convincing me of their love for the user but the actual developers, project managers etc are there to create a product for users much like any other organisation.
I also think arguing over where the Internet would be without microsoft is a pretty impossible call to make, if there were no MS i’m sure there’d be another corporate monster equally as monopolistic and loved/hated.
Hey Danny: My major beef with Microsoft is not that it is a huge, evil company. I’ve come to accept the fact that we work with products from huge, evil companies. Heck, I use a Mac! I mean apple makes billions and doesn’t bat an eyelid when legally threathening people who use the word “podcast” and suing their own fanbase (just two examples, really.) But they make usable stuff. I don’t have to activate my OS X. I don’t have to download a stupid plugin that hangs my browser just to download a browser. I don’t have to look through feature lists on the fifty billion different versions of Vista to discover which version I need. I’ve got OS X super-duper-version and it’s the only version there is.
I hear ya man, the points made about checking authentication etc agreed are all horrible user experiences. I have a Dell desktop with bundled XP and the genuine windows key super-glued to the side and MS STILL accuses me of using non-authentic software??? MS said contact Dell, Dell said contact MS, I got really annoyed and now it’s sitting pretty running Linux SuSe and hosting my website :D.
However, I think the main reasons people do hate MS is :
- because they are a monopoly
- their “IT expert” friends have told them so
- they have dodgy licenses and don’t like being busted for it
I think if you asked the majority of “haters” they’d struggle to justify it beyond bandwagon hatred. Justified bitching about stupid pointless forced downloads however is perfectly acceptable
I also wouldn’t be surprised if some MS staff DO read this blog regarding the feedback giving.
I’ve had two lay-friends re-install winXP just this week, due to viruses.
Microsoft is terrible. Consider investing in a Mac. If you compare spec for spec the mac is only a mere 100 or 200 dollars more and you get a fantastic computer!
I think you’re being a tad dramatic.
You are a somewhat technical minded person, and therefore you will look for a solution for your problems before hand.
But windows is not made for technical people, it’s made for your parents.
And installing the genuine advantage tool is nothing to be afraid of.
However, if you pirated the software, and are bitching because Microsoft is getting sick and tired of it, well buddy Cry me a fucking river, buy a copy you lazy douche bag.
Windows is the worst operating system to give your parents (unless they treated you really badly as a child, in which case, fair is fair!)
“Genuine Advantage” penalizes not the software pirate (who will hack his copy of Windows anyway) but actual customers who pay for their applications. I adore the true genuine advantage of having an operating system that doesn’t bloat itself with code that doesn’t offer *me* any use. (Oh yeah, and OS X also “just works” which is also another huge genuine advantage.)
PS. I’ve got 10 licenses to Windows in my subscription plan. Unfortunately, I still need to test on Windows. Otherwise, I’d happily not touch it ever again. I wasted way too many years and way too much aggravation with Windows. Switching to OS X has been the best thing — it’s made me love using a computer again. And that, unlike some “Genuine Advantage”, is priceless.
I would love to tell you of our experience my wife and I add with the Big Blue Box (Best Buy) in Green Bay Wisconsin. Trust me if I would have know of your Web site I would have heeded the warnings and advice of others that have had just horrible experience with Best Buy.
Well here goes:
My wife and I decided to take some of our Tax Return to buy us a new Washer, and Dryer. Well as usual we went to BB as we have done for in the last (9) years to buy all of our Big Price appliance items, as we have bought our (3) Desktop Computers, (2) Refrigerator, (1) Dishwasher, (2) TV’s (3) DVD Player’s, (2) VCR’s, (3) Surround Sound Systems…. etc…well you get the picture, close to $10,000.00 over those (9) years.
Things seem to go smoothly with the purchase of both of them till the arraigning of the FREE delivery that was with the package deal. But the sales person worked out the glitches an made the delivery on Wed’s the 14th of February in the late afternoon. I informed the sales person that we had some serious plans made, and could they arraign it before or after the 14th. “No” was the reply that it was the only day they could make the delivery. Well ok I said, “but let’s make sure it happens”. No problem was the reply; a they would call us the night before to confirm the time in the afternoon. “Great”, I said, let’s do it.
The night of the 13th we waited till around 9pm for their call. Nothing, no call. So I called the store a talked to the sale person that sold us the Washer/Dryer, and asked when they would be delivered. I waited on hold for over 20 minutes. Finally I called back and asked for the Manager on Duty. Waited other 10 minutes till he came on the line. I explained the situation to him; he stated he would check into this. After other 10 minutes he game back on the line. He stated that the Order for delivery was CANCELLED and that there was not going to be a delivery. Well my jaw dropped to the floor. “What the Hell was going on”, I asked, I know we didn’t cancel the order for delivery. I informed him of this and said this was not acceptable and that they would need to make the delivery as promised and that we would not be available for any other day. And why the Hell had this had happen. After waiting for other 15 minutes on the phone he finally came back on with “ it will be delivered tomorrow between 4pm an 6pm” OK I said great. As I was about to thank him he hung up, without an apology of any kind, or any explanation of what was going on? Well this should have clued me into Best Buy’s customer service policy of SCREW’EM AN LOSES’EM. Well as promise they did deliver the machines on time, but not with out some hassles there too.
Where comes the good part:
The following week my wife an I decided to buy a new laptop computer, and of course BB was having a Package Deal on a Toshiba laptop with Windows Vista installed and also with Mini mouse, and carrying case. This sounded great, and in our price arrange too. So we went into the Store and as usual we had to hunt down someone in the computer department to help us with the purchase. After finding a fresh Snot Nose Narcissistic Kid barely out of high school to help us, we decided to ask a few questions about the New Windows Vista system. We wanted to know if this laptop would be able to communicate with the other (3) computers we have in our home running Windows XP? And would it work with our Linksys Network Router System? And will we be able to share files, and to use our Lexmark Printer with this new Windows Vista, and our Network? “ Well of course it would…was his reply, with no problems. “ Well with that, and the blind trust I put in people we bought the laptop, and the extended service plan. And back home with our new toy.
Well we got it home and started to set it up, and everything was going as smooth as silk till we tried to set up the Network to share files/folders with the other computers, and the printer. Now I am not illiterate when it comes to computers, nor am I an expert, but I knew something was a miss, and something was not right. Well it was late and we decided to wait till the morning to finish the setup.
The following day was the Worst Frkin Nightmare I have had in 35 years (showing my age of 55) of dealing with any big business, and of course the worst day I ever had with Best Buy.
I kept trying to make the Laptop communicate with the Network, and my other (3) computers. I would keep getting a Microsoft Windows Error of “not finding a Network”. After spending an hour on their web site I could find nothing, so I called them. I spent over 45 minutes waiting; finally I spoke to someone about the problem (because I thought since it was a Windows Error the would be able to help) no such luck. They said I would need to contact Toshiba about this since this was an OEM (original equipment manufacture) problem, and not theirs. “Great” Called Toshiba, nothing, this were their service person informs me that the new Windows Vista program will not work with the network, router, a printer if my other (3) computers are running Windows XP. “HOLY COW POOP”. This was Frkin Peachy. Toshiba suggested to call Best Buy to see what they can do for me, buy asking someone there if they could help set up the network to communicate with the other computers. Sounded like sense. So I did.
So I called the Big Blue Box (BB) and spoke to same manager I had dealt with on the delivery problem. Wow that was the most stupid mistake I ever made. This manager was the biggest “DICK” I ever spoke to. I calmly explained the problem to him, an how I was led to believe that there would be no problem with this Laptop running Windows Vista to work with my computers, network, and printer. He told me point blank told me that his sales person would have “never would have told me such a thing”. God I was outraged, not only was He calling me a Lair but also it was quite clear that this worthless manager was not going to help me at all. I asked to speak to his Boss, (the store manager) SHE was not there. Then I asked how to get in contact with his District manager…. guess what…that’s right, he refused to give me that info also stating he did not know how, an even if he did he would not give me that info, because all customer concerns, and problems are handled at the store level, and that this problem did not warrant any further attention. What a worthless piece of human waste. I asked what was the name of his store manager, at first he was very hesent, and then he gave me her name.
Well for the next (4) days I spent calling the Best Buy customer service line, (what a gdamn joke this is), calling their Corp Office, calling their District office, trying to get someone to listen and care about my problem. Again No-one gave a Royal flying Rats Ass about what was going on. Only to inform me that all the customer relation problems needs are handle at the Store Level. “My God, don’t they understand that here in lies the problem the Store Management and the rotten little peckerhead that sold me the Laptop. “NO>>>HELL NO”. So after nearly going to the Hospital because on my Blood Pressure I decided to give it up. Knowing that Best Buy had SCREWED ME IN THE ASS AN NEVER USED ANY TYPE OF LUB TO EASE THE PAIN. Then out of the Blue the lousy Store Manager called an gave me the lamest apology I ever heard but still would not help me with my problem only offering to send out the GEEK Squad to make my Laptop work with my other computers, an network. But of course this would cost me other $200.00 for their service. God what kind of sick joke these folks live under, what kind of CON-Game they are playing on the costumer, what kind of people believe they would have me come back an waste my money in their store after this kind of Bull Sh___t.
God I pray, and beg anyone reading this not to buy your need’s at Best Buy, they will Lie, Cheat, an screw you up the behind so hard, that you will see stars. If any one reading this and still believes they will get good service from BB, all you will get is a Stroke.
BEST BUY GO TO HELL YOU ROTTEN MOTHERF___KERS.
Hi Ric,
Sorry to hear of your troubles, man. I hope it gets resolved. You might try writing to one of the computer magazines that has a consumer protection column — perhaps they can help.
That’s it! I’m switching my 500 company to MAC.
I stopped using the evil microsoft years ago. It sucked them and it sucks now,… and it will always suck. I use Linux and wil always use it,… it is more stable and solid as os’ go. Try it you will like it,… more than ms!
Will
I dont intend on this getting posted, so this is a little message to you… Your a fucking crybaby… Grow up… Whaaaaaaa, I have to show MS i didnt steal from them before I can install an update… Boo-fucking-hooo you fucktard. Im surprised I found this shithole of a site, but the best part about it is that you write on it like it matters. Heres a little help… Your site doesnt matter, it doesnt benefit anyone, your not saving lives or curing diseases, yet you write like you matter in the world. Why dont you take your biased bullshit and shove it up your ass loser.
Wow, someone’s having a bad day! What a lot of negativity to be carrying around inside you like that. Dude, chill out, life’s too short. Maybe get a Mac and let go off all that MS aggression?
Whatever you do, don’t go around telling other people that the things they do don’t matter, because they do matter. I personally couldn’t care less about your negativity but there are those that you could seriously hurt with your attitude. This site has benefited many people over the years and I’ve got the thank-you emails and bunny messages to prove it.
Instead of anonymously spewing hate in a cowardly manner, go and do something useful with your life. The things you do, _do_ matter.
And if you want to be taken seriously, wash out that potty mouth and try writing something that you are proud to sign your name to.
I hope you can let go of your hate and embrace something positive in the future.
Hey John Doe! It’s “you’re a fucking crybaby” not “your a fucking crybaby”. Learn to spell and always remember to leave a post BEFORE you hit the whiskey…
P.S. There should also be a comma between ass and loser, loser.
Hi there,
I found this forum by ‘googling’ the phrase “Why do people hate microsoft” and the link to this site was the first on the list of results. I’ve read many of the posts here in an effort to find an answer to my question and I’m very sad to say that I’m even more confused than I was before.
I can understand a person getting frustrated when their hardare/software doesn’t work as it should but mechanical/system failure is not a problem that is limited to PCs. Automobiles break down all the time but people don’t generally hate Ford, BMW, Mercedez, etc. So why the contempt for Microsoft?
I’ve been using a PC for over half my life (not the same PC by the way) and I’ve experienced every kind of technical problem imaginable. I’ve seriously come close to taking a sledge hammer to a PC in the past and I’ve used several PCs as door stops or stools to reach high shelves but I’ve never experienced anything that could inspire me to hate MS with the passion that I’ve seen on this site.
I really don’t understand it! Is it the fact that they’re a money-grabbing bunch of ********? Well, so are most large corporations! The purpose of any business is to make money!
Is it because they try really, really, hard to stop people from stealing their stuff? Well, so do you and I because we all have locks on homes, cars, suitcases, etc.
Is it because their products keep breaking down? Everything that “works” can also break down! Including our bodies but you don’t hate your parents or God!!! Well, maybe you do but that’s a whole other can of worms.
Is it because their products are difficult to use? All computers are difficult to use if you don’t know what you’re doing, regardless of the OS. And by that, I’m not implying that anyone here doesn’t know what they’re doing. In my experience as an IT consultant/Trainer I’ve found that many people throw common sense out of the window when they sit down in front of a computer. If they were in their car and they saw a sign that side STOP, they would stop. If they were crossing the street and saw a “DON’T WALK” sign, they wouldn’t walk. But when they’re in front of a computer screen and see a “PLEASE CLICK OK TO CONTINUE” sign, they put their hand up in class and say in the most whiney voice possible, “what should I do?” This surely must account for a lot negative experiences with the average Joe. For those of us who are more technically minded, could it be that some people take the things they don’t like about a MS product and use them as reasons to say the product is bad or difficult? That’s just personal preference! For everything you hate about a MS product there are probably dozens of people who love that same thing and vice versa.
Is it because they don’t listen to your views or treat you as unimportant? So do most politicians but I bet you still vote!
Is it because so many people complain about them? That’s because they have the majority share of the market. Its simple mathematics! Its no different to road traffic accidents. Every year car accidents outnumber bike accidents. Why? Because there are more cars than bikes!!!
Is it because there are so many PC viruses out there? Again, majority market share!
I’m starting to think that hatred of MS is a childish trend. Just like in school where to be accepted in certain social circles you have to have “that purse” or wear “those sneakers,” it seems that to be accepted in certain professional, social, or even political circles in the grown up world, you have to hate Microsoft. Maybe a person or people a very long time ago had a legitimate reason for hating Microsoft and then others who wanted to be acknowledged by them for whatever reason said that they hated them too as a way in. Then eventually everyone started jumping on the band wagon. The whole thing reminds me of the kid’s story “The Emperor’s New Clothes.”
Anyway, if anyone has a definitive answer to my question, please post.